Hill Cumorah

The location of the Hill Cumorah and Ramah

Some other teachings:

1]
First Presidency member Ivins in the 1928 General Conference:

"So far as we have information this was the final disposition which was made of the records given into the custody of Mormon, from the plates of. Nephi. This latter, with the addition of the Book of Ether, and the few chapters written by Moroni, constitute the record contained in the Book of Mormon.
All of the remaining records, Mormon tells us, were deposited in the Hill Cumorah.
That the Hill Cumorah and the Hill Ramah are identical is shown by the following: Moroni, in the Book of Ether, says ...
The passages which I have quoted from the Book of Mormon and the more extended discussion of this subject by Elder B. H. Roberts which was published in The Deseret News of March 3, 1928, definitely establish the following facts: That the Hill Cumorah, and the Hill Ramah are identical; that it was around this hill that the armies of both the Jaredites and Nephites, fought their great last battles; that it was in this hill that Mormon deposited all of the sacred records which had been entrusted to his care by Ammaron, except the abridg-ment which he had made from the plates of Nephi, which were delivered into the hands of his son, Moroni. We know positively that it was in this hill that Moroni deposited the abridgment made by his father,and his own abridgment of the record of the Jaredites, and that it was from this hill that Joseph Smith obtained possession of them.
According to the Book of Mormon many hundreds of thousands of people fell in battle around this hill, and the immediate vicinity. It was here that two once powerful nations were exterminated so far as their natural existence was concerned. It was here that these nations gathered together for their last great struggles.
These people were human, as we are; they carried with them their most precious possessions until the last, and when the end of the mighty struggle came, and the result was in doubt, they hid them away in order that they might not fall into the hands of their enemies.
Without doubt these treasures lie concealed today, some of them, at least, to be brought forth in the not distant future. How soon this will be we do not know, but this is certain, we are more than a century nearer that time than we were at the time when Joseph Smith took from their resting place in the Hill Cumorah, the plates from which he translated the contents of the Book of Mormon.
All of these incidents to which I have referred, my brethren and sisters, are very closely associated with this particular spot in the State of New York. Therefore I feel, as I said in the beginning of my remarks, that the acquisition of that spot of ground is more than an incident in the history of the Church; it is an epoch—an epoch which in my opinion is fraught with that which may become of greater interest to the Latter-day Saints than that which has already occurred. We know that all of these records, all the sacred records of the Nephite people, were deposited by Mormon in that hill. That incident alone is sufficient to make it the sacred and hallowed spot that it is to us. I thank God that in a way which seems to have been providential it has come into the possession of the Church.
I bear witness to you that the words which I have read here, quoted from the Book of Mormon, which refer to the future, will be fulfilled. Those additional records will come forth, they will be published to the world, that the children of our Father may be converted to faith in Christ, our Lord and Redeemer, through obedience to the doctrines which he taught. May God our Father hasten that day, is my humble prayer, and I ask it through Jesus Christ. Amen."

2]
"It is known that the Hill Cumorah where the Nephites were destroyed is the hill where the Jaredites were also destroyed. This hill was known to the Jaredites as Rama. It was approximately near to the waters of Ripliancum, which the Book of Ether says, "by interpretation, is large, or to exceed all." Mormon adds: "And it came to pass that we did march forth to the land of Cumorah, and we did pitch our tents round about the hill Cumorah; and it was in a land of many waters, rivers, and fountains; and here we had hope to gain advantage over the Lamanites.
It must be conceded that this description fits perfectly the land of Cumorah in New York, as it has been known since the visitation of Moroni to the Prophet Joseph Smith, for the hill is in the proximity of the Great Lakes and also in the land of many rivers and fountains. Moreover, the Prophet Joseph Smith himself is on record, definitely declaring the present hill called Cumorah to be the exact hill spoken of in the Book of Mormon.
Further, the fact that all of his associates from the beginning down have spoken of it as the identical hill where Mormon and Moroni hid the records, must carry some weight. It is difficult for a reasonable person to believe that such men as Oliver Cowdery, Brigham Young, Parley P. Pratt, Orson Pratt, David Whitmer, and many others, could speak frequently of the Spot where the Prophet Joseph Smith obtained the plates as the Hill Cumorah, and not be corrected by the Prophet, if that were not the fact. That they did speak of this hill in the days of the Prophet in this definite manner is an established record of history" (Joseph Fielding Smith, Doctrines of Salvation, Volume 3).

3]
President Marion G. Romney, Second Counselor in the First Presidency, bore testimony of the events of the Book of Mormon in relation to the hill Cumorah in General Conference, October 4, 1975.
"In the western part of the state of New York near Palmyra is a prominent hill known as the "hill Cumorah." (Morm. 6:6.) On July twenty-fifth of this year, as I stood on the crest of that hill admiring with awe the breathtaking panorama which stretched out before me on every hand, my mind reverted to the events which occurred in that vicinity some twenty-five centuries ago—events which brought to an end the great Jaredite nation.
This second civilization to which I refer, the Nephites, flourished in America between 600 b.c. and a.d. 400. Their civilization came to an end for the same reason, at the same place, and in the same manner as did the Jaredites’.
And when they had gone through and hewn down all my people save it were twenty and four of us, (among whom was my son Moroni) and we having survived the dead of our people, did behold on the morrow … from the top of the hill Cumorah, [230,000] of my people who were hewn down, …
Now my beloved brethren and sisters everywhere, both members of the Church and nonmembers, I bear you my personal witness that I know that the things I have presented to you today are true—both those pertaining to past events and those pertaining to events yet to come. (Marion G. Romney, General Conference, October 4, 1975).

4]
In 1990 the office of the First Presidency, in a letter written by the Secretary to the First Presidency, stated that Cumorah is in New York:
Dear Bishop Brooks:
I have been asked to forward to you for acknowledgment and handling the enclosed copy of a letter to President Gordon B. Hinckley from Ronnie Sparks of your ward. Brother Sparks inquired about the location of the Hill Cumorah mentioned in the Book of Mormon, where the last battle between the Nephites and Lamanites took place.
The Church has long maintained, as attested to by references in the writings of General Authorities, that the Hill Cumorah in western New York state is the same as referenced in the Book of Mormon.
The Brethren appreciate your assistance in responding to this inquiry, and asked that you convey to Brother Sparks their commendation for his gospel study.

5]
"... at that time lying buried in the side of a hill near Joseph's home. The hill, which was known by one division of the ancient peoples as Cumorah, by another as Ramah, is situated near Palmyra in the county of Wayne, State of New York.
Here they became a flourishing nation; but, giving way in time to internal dissensions, they divided into factions, which warred with one another until the people were totally destroyed. This destruction, which occurred near the hill Ramah, afterward known among the Nephites as Cumorah, probably took place at about the time of Lehi's landing in South America" (James E. Talmage, Articles of Faith).

6]
"At about one mile west rises another ridge of less height, running parallel with the former, leaving a beautiful vale between. The soil is of the first quality for the country, and under a state of cultivation, which gives a prospect at once imposing, when one reflects on the fact, that here, between these hills, the entire power and national strength of both the Jaredites and Nephites were destroyed".
"... from the days of Lehi to his own time, after which he deposited, as he says, on the 529th page, all the records in this same hill, Cumorah, and after gave his small record to his son Moroni, who, as appears from the same, finished, after witnessing the extinction of his people as a nation".

"This hill, by the Jaredites, was called Ramah: by it, or around it, pitched the famous army of Coriantumr their tents. Coriantumr was the last king of the Jaredites" (Letter VII. Oliver Cowdery to W. W. Phelps. Latter Day Saints’ Messenger and Advocate, July 1835).

Scripture Central, although not an official branch of the LDS Church, nevertheless tries to cast doubt on previous statements made by LDS leaders on the location of the Hill Cumorah.

https://scripturecentral.org/knowhy/where-is-the-location-of-the-hill-cumorah

While not coming out in a forceful admission that previous LDS leaders were false and leading their followers astray, the current LDS Church just issues a blanket "we don't know" when it comes to Book of Mormon geograhy.

In the Book of Mormon narrative, Cumorah is part of a larger geographic system that includes the land northward, the land southward, east and west seas, and the "narrow neck of land" connecting them.

Early believers were taught and believed the Book of Mormon described events spanning much of the Americas. In that older "hemispheric" view the narrow neck of land was often associated with Isthmus of Panama. Nephite and Lamanite civilizations supposedly spread across large parts of the continents, and the final battle at Hill Cumorah was simply much farther north.

The "many waters, rivers, and fountains" language is actually from Ether 15:8–11, contextually nearby passages and earlier Ether geography descriptions (especially Ether 2–10), where the Jaredite land is described broadly as a water-rich environment.

The actual textual link between "Ramah" and "Cumorah" is this:

Ether 15:11 - "And it came to pass that they did pitch their tents by the hill Ramah; and it was that same hill where my father Mormon did hide up the records unto the Lord".

Mormon 6:2 - "And it came to pass that we did march forth to the land of Cumorah".

So the text itself creates this equivalence: Jaredite name: Ramah, Nephite name: Cumorah, same hill, according to the record. That's the actual internal connection.

The "many waters, rivers, and fountains" idea comes from broader Jaredite geography descriptions in Ether.

So when people connect it to the New York Hill Cumorah, they are doing this:

Ether describes a land with abundant water systems.
Ramah/Cumorah is in that Jaredite land.
Western New York has many lakes, rivers, and wetlands (Finger Lakes region).

That is why LDS leaders taught they are the same hill and that hill is in New York.

Another comment I've seen is that Moroni travelled for many years and over a long distance to finally bury the plates, so the Hill Cumorah could not be in New York State. The Book of Mormon suggests roughly 35–40 years (about 36 years)—but it doesn't give a travel log.

Here's how we can bracket it from the text:

AD 384: Nephites gather to Cumorah — "three hundred and eighty and four years had passed away" (Mormon 6:5). Around that same end-period, Mormon gives Moroni the "few plates" (Mormon 6:6).

AD 400: Moroni is alive, finishing Mormon's record, and says he'll "write and hide up the records" (Mormon 8:4, 6).

AD 421: Moroni writes his final words and says, "I seal up these records" (Moroni 10:1–2). In that span he says, "I wander whithersoever I can for the safety of mine own life" (Moroni 1:3). So, textually, Moroni's "wandering" and the process of finishing/then sealing the record could cover from ~AD 385 to AD 421—about 36 years.

Moroni wandered because he was being hunted and would be killed if he didn't deny Christ (Moroni 1:2-3).

The Book of Mormon doesn't say how Moroni wandered (routes, method of travel, companions, etc.) so one cannot assume he must have travelled a long distance (from Mexico to New York) to eventually bury the plates. New York State is a pretty big land mass to wander in. So the Book of Mormon leaves room for anything from moving around within a relatively limited region to traveling much farther—it simply doesn't specify.

So the teachings of LDS leaders in the past are still plausible. But yet modern LDS scholars and other believers consider them as false teachers.

Then add to this the supposed revelation in Doctrine and Covenants 128. "Glad tidings from Cumorah! Moroni, an angel from heaven, declaring the fulfilment of the prophets—the book to be revealed".

In their article, Scripture Central also says "Due to inconsistencies between the location of the hill described in the Book of Mormonand the real-world topography of western New York, as well as the lack of anyarchaeological evidence for the violent, mass destruction of hundreds of thousands ofpeople in one concentrated location in that area through sustained warfare (cf. Mormon6:10–15), some have suggested that the location of the final battle took place somewhere other than the New York hill, such as in modern day Mexico just northwest of the Isthmus of Tehuantepec".

The reason that there is no archaeological evidence in New York is because the events of the Book of Mormon didn't occur.

Also, there are no archaeological discoveries in or northwest of the Isthmus of Tehuantepec that are accepted by mainstream archaeology as clearly supporting the historical claims of the Book of Mormon.